Comments on: Norman Mailer and E http://www.teleread.org/2007/11/10/norman-mailer-and-e/ News & views on e-books, libraries, publishing and related topics Sun, 22 Nov 2009 08:28:10 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Ted Burke http://www.teleread.org/2007/11/10/norman-mailer-and-e/comment-page-1/#comment-687366 Ted Burke Fri, 11 Jan 2008 15:05:30 +0000 http://www.teleread.org/blog/?p=7557#comment-687366 This is one of the better posts I've read about Mailer and his ideas since his death, and I hope it sparks a serious re-examination of his ideas. Mailer had said once that the internet was the "biggest waste of time since masturbation", but given how much he liked to be on the spot and have his say on national political and cultural currents, it's a safe bet that he would have been a blogger had the web been available to him. Mailer's ideas about technology and commercial culture interfering with cohesive thinking isn't without force; the consolidation of most of our media into the hands of very few corporate owners subjects all views to mere mouthfuls of caption ready mouthfuls . A counter view to the mainstream view is not allowed to have a second breath of air in this climate, and it is seems the purpose of the commercial interruptions in the discourse is not just to sell products but to distract an electorate as well. It's a digital Roman Circus. This is one of the better posts I’ve read about Mailer and his ideas since his death, and I hope it sparks a serious re-examination of his ideas. Mailer had said once that the internet was the “biggest waste of time since masturbation”, but given how much he liked to be on the spot and have his say on national political and cultural currents, it’s a safe bet that he would have been a blogger had the web been available to him. Mailer’s ideas about technology and commercial culture interfering with cohesive thinking isn’t without force; the consolidation of most of our media into the hands of very few corporate owners subjects all views to mere mouthfuls of caption ready mouthfuls . A counter view to the mainstream view is not allowed to have a second breath of air in this climate, and it is seems the purpose of the commercial interruptions in the discourse is not just to sell products but to distract an electorate as well. It’s a digital Roman Circus.

]]> By: David Rothman http://www.teleread.org/2007/11/10/norman-mailer-and-e/comment-page-1/#comment-616392 David Rothman Sun, 11 Nov 2007 15:50:24 +0000 http://www.teleread.org/blog/?p=7557#comment-616392 Garson, thanks. I agree with you that wonderful narrative can happen within videos. But it's not the same kind of narrative. Nothing beats text for getting inside the characters' heads, for example. As for radio, it's great at encouraging imagination. Thanks, David Garson, thanks. I agree with you that wonderful narrative can happen within videos. But it’s not the same kind of narrative. Nothing beats text for getting inside the characters’ heads, for example.

As for radio, it’s great at encouraging imagination.

Thanks,
David

]]> By: Garson O'Toole http://www.teleread.org/2007/11/10/norman-mailer-and-e/comment-page-1/#comment-616345 Garson O'Toole Sun, 11 Nov 2007 15:13:01 +0000 http://www.teleread.org/blog/?p=7557#comment-616345 So Norman Mailer the youthful firebrand was transformed into an elderly curmudgeon complaining about the non-reading unthinking children of “today” who are exposed to the commercialized staccato stream of television. David Rothman sympathetically identifies two modern menaces to cohesive thought, namely Twitter and YouTube. If only we could go back to the halcyon years of deep uninterrupted and ruminatory thought. What was the atmosphere like when tyro Mailer was preparing to cogitate profoundly? Consider this quote from Wilbur Schramm’s 1954 opus “The Process and Effects of Mass Communication”: <blockquote>... it is possible that they experience a frustration-and-rejection reaction when they are exposed to the high and jerky tempo and short attention span of our usual motion picture and public addresses, and especially to our newsreels and radio programs.</blockquote> Mailer was born in 1923 and radio drama became popular in the 1920s and 1930s. Of course, movies and newsreels antedate his birth. How did Mailer escape unscathed from the mind-numbing and debilitating effects of radio programs and newsreels? I have been listening to complaints about the “short attention span” of the incorrigible young whippersnappers of this or that generation for decades so the remarks above are intended as a humorous retort. Admittedly television is more pervasive and immersive than newsreels. Looking forward there is another substantial difference between the “media” of today and the past. YouTube, blogs, Wikipedia, and twitter often encourage participation instead of passivity. Mailer proclaims that the “love of narrative was so important to us.” Yet, grand compelling narratives are not unique to the book format. Movie lovers embraced “The Lord of the Rings” trilogy with a run time of eleven hours in its fancy DVD edition. Television series such as “Babylon Five”, “24” and “Lost” have very long narrative arcs. The first series of “24” has a run time of 1152 minutes (19.2 hours) and that is considerably longer than most books when read as audio books. So Norman Mailer the youthful firebrand was transformed into an elderly curmudgeon complaining about the non-reading unthinking children of “today” who are exposed to the commercialized staccato stream of television. David Rothman sympathetically identifies two modern menaces to cohesive thought, namely Twitter and YouTube.

If only we could go back to the halcyon years of deep uninterrupted and ruminatory thought. What was the atmosphere like when tyro Mailer was preparing to cogitate profoundly? Consider this quote from Wilbur Schramm’s 1954 opus “The Process and Effects of Mass Communication”:

… it is possible that they experience a frustration-and-rejection reaction when they are exposed to the high and jerky tempo and short attention span of our usual motion picture and public addresses, and especially to our newsreels and radio programs.

Mailer was born in 1923 and radio drama became popular in the 1920s and 1930s. Of course, movies and newsreels antedate his birth. How did Mailer escape unscathed from the mind-numbing and debilitating effects of radio programs and newsreels?

I have been listening to complaints about the “short attention span” of the incorrigible young whippersnappers of this or that generation for decades so the remarks above are intended as a humorous retort. Admittedly television is more pervasive and immersive than newsreels. Looking forward there is another substantial difference between the “media” of today and the past. YouTube, blogs, Wikipedia, and twitter often encourage participation instead of passivity.

Mailer proclaims that the “love of narrative was so important to us.” Yet, grand compelling narratives are not unique to the book format. Movie lovers embraced “The Lord of the Rings” trilogy with a run time of eleven hours in its fancy DVD edition. Television series such as “Babylon Five”, “24” and “Lost” have very long narrative arcs. The first series of “24” has a run time of 1152 minutes (19.2 hours) and that is considerably longer than most books when read as audio books.

]]> By: David Rothman http://www.teleread.org/2007/11/10/norman-mailer-and-e/comment-page-1/#comment-614482 David Rothman Sat, 10 Nov 2007 17:52:53 +0000 http://www.teleread.org/blog/?p=7557#comment-614482 Thanks for your thoughtful message, Aaron. If we're going to have interruptions, let as many of them as possible be book related! I heartily approve of your granular approach. You're still serving the cause of narrative and adapting it to people's habits. A long way from just frivolous Twitter stuff! Even Twitter has its place; I just don't want to see it over done. (If this exchange serves as a plug for <a href="bookglutton.com" rel="nofollow">BG</a>, then so much the better!) David Thanks for your thoughtful message, Aaron. If we’re going to have interruptions, let as many of them as possible be book related! I heartily approve of your granular approach. You’re still serving the cause of narrative and adapting it to people’s habits. A long way from just frivolous Twitter stuff! Even Twitter has its place; I just don’t want to see it over done. (If this exchange serves as a plug for BG, then so much the better!)

David

]]> By: Aaron Miller http://www.teleread.org/2007/11/10/norman-mailer-and-e/comment-page-1/#comment-614443 Aaron Miller Sat, 10 Nov 2007 17:31:41 +0000 http://www.teleread.org/blog/?p=7557#comment-614443 A set of interruptions seems to describe television programming and the currently evolving state of the web. It's only a matter of time before television media outlets take over, placing large TV-style interstitial ads everywhere. But the real interruptions are more inherent in the medium of the web than they are on TV. We make our own interruptions happen, with bookmarks and RSS feeds and Twitter and IM and our multiple email accounts and Skype. We want more content, which means content outlets are less pressured to produce quality, and quality is relegated to the same soundbite status as everything else. Acordingly, we have less time, and thus longer works suffer in this medium. At Bookglutton, we know that people will move to reading books with their email, and we know that this means longer, older, less commercialized works will suffer in popularity. So will non-genre work. Anything difficult to categorize requires individual patience, because every individual needs to categorize before they appreciate. We think that allowing more granular attention to longer works will keep them in the public mind longer. Discussing something's parts will sustain interest and focus much longer than praising or dismissing it as a whole. So while we utilize chat and topic-based pubsub to surround each book, we want people to be able to turn it off when they want. Which is better than muting the sound on a commercial. Aaron Miller bookglutton.com A set of interruptions seems to describe television programming and the currently evolving state of the web. It’s only a matter of time before television media outlets take over, placing large TV-style interstitial ads everywhere. But the real interruptions are more inherent in the medium of the web than they are on TV. We make our own interruptions happen, with bookmarks and RSS feeds and Twitter and IM and our multiple email accounts and Skype. We want more content, which means content outlets are less pressured to produce quality, and quality is relegated to the same soundbite status as everything else. Acordingly, we have less time, and thus longer works suffer in this medium. At Bookglutton, we know that people will move to reading books with their email, and we know that this means longer, older, less commercialized works will suffer in popularity. So will non-genre work. Anything difficult to categorize requires individual patience, because every individual needs to categorize before they appreciate. We think that allowing more granular attention to longer works will keep them in the public mind longer. Discussing something’s parts will sustain interest and focus much longer than praising or dismissing it as a whole. So while we utilize chat and topic-based pubsub to surround each book, we want people to be able to turn it off when they want. Which is better than muting the sound on a commercial.

Aaron Miller
bookglutton.com

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