Comments on: Student runs guerilla banned-book locker library

By: Dhamu

Dhamu — Fri, 29 May 2009 21:31:07 +0000

Except we don’t use gender-neutral pronouns when we know a gender, as you do with Chris. We use epicene pronouns in cases where gender is unknown: “If the reader thought that, xe is mistaken” or “Each student must turn in xer phone before the test; it will be returned to xim afterward.”

In practice, neutral pronouns won’t become standard in English, and though they can be used in select (primarily written) groups, most people usually reconstruct sentences to use plural forms, or use singular-they as many well-known authors before them have.

By: Cat Faber

Cat Faber — Fri, 29 May 2009 01:30:27 +0000

“Dude.”

[eyeroll]

Seriously, “he” is emphatically not gender neutral. Here, let me demonstrate:

“I met my old friend Chris yesterday. He was hungry, so we went to his favorite nearby restaurant. He and I were working our way through the crab salad (not bad!) and his new baby started crying. One of the things I really admire about Chris is his matter-of-fact approach to these kinds of problems. He just spread a baby blanket over his front, unbuttoned his shirt and bra and started nursing. Worked a treat; the baby quieted right down and we finished catching up over a couple of the best cups of coffee I’ve had in a while.”

Now, are you seriously trying to tell me you weren’t surprised when Chris started nursing, because you really, honestly, assume “he” is gender neutral and so you remembered all along that in the absence of gender cues (given the gender neutral pronouns), there was a 51% chance that Chris was female?

Or are you just buying into the language’s archaic assumption that anyone worth talking about is male, except for certain special cases marked for the audience with a special pronoun?

If you’re ready to join the 21st century, a new pronoun like “zie” is actually much better than “he” for a gender neutral situation; at least your audience is alerted to the fact that they don’t actually know the gender of the person referred to. So they won’t be weirded out when zie starts nursing.

If you come out in hives at the thought of a new pronoun, you can simply reset “they” to be number neutral as well as gender neutral. Whatever floats your boat.

By: John Perkins

John Perkins — Wed, 27 May 2009 02:00:24 +0000

Oh? If “he” is gender neutral, what is the third person singular pronoun for males?

“Dude.”

By: Cat Faber

Cat Faber — Wed, 27 May 2009 00:33:22 +0000

But for what it’s worth, “he” has been for hundreds of years and still is the official gender-neutral pronoun in the English language.

Oh? If “he” is gender neutral, what is the third person singular pronoun for males?

By: Rob Preece, Publisher

Rob Preece, Publisher — Tue, 26 May 2009 14:24:13 +0000

In the US, lending is not illegal. In other countries, there are restrictions and authors receive royalties on lending. Different countries, different rules.

Rob Preece
Publisher

By: Chris Meadows

Chris Meadows — Tue, 26 May 2009 13:37:43 +0000

I was under the impression that lending was covered under “First Sale,” whether you’re a “real” library or not. (And who exactly “authorizes” libraries, for that matter?)

By: Steve Jordan

Steve Jordan — Tue, 26 May 2009 12:49:27 +0000

Actually, what Kat is doing probably IS illegal, not because the books are banned, but because lending probably violates the copyright agreements of those books (because he is not an “authorized” lending library).

But in a case such as this, his situation would earn him brownie points in most jurisdictions in the country (with the exception, I presume, of the state that banned those books… shame, shame).

Do I believe the story? Well… I’ve heard far weirder.

By: Chris Meadows

Chris Meadows — Tue, 26 May 2009 05:58:30 +0000

Of course, as I said, there is the possibility that this is a hoax. It does sound almost too good to be true.

By: John Perkins

John Perkins — Tue, 26 May 2009 04:48:23 +0000

That is so incredibly awesome. The said thing is that if I were still in high school, I’d probably make of the kid.

By: Chris Meadows

Chris Meadows — Tue, 26 May 2009 02:27:20 +0000

Fair enough.

But for what it’s worth, “he” has been for hundreds of years and still is the official gender-neutral pronoun in the English language. I think tortured neologistic constructions like “zie” just end up looking silly.

By: Cat Faber

Cat Faber — Tue, 26 May 2009 01:12:12 +0000

The student in question is writing in first person, but given that the username zie chose is “Kat Atreides” and the user icon is a pink rose, I’m guessing zie is a she.

I agree that she deserves a medal. I think she doesn’t need to worry too much about detention or expulsion–if she mentions the cause in her essay any college or university worth her attention will be *more*, not less, interested in having her as a student.