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	<title>Comments on: Amazon not revealing device limits for Kindle books before you buy? If so, should the FTC investigate?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/</link>
	<description>News &#38; views on e-books, libraries, publishing and related topics</description>
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		<title>By: r4i</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1093773</link>
		<dc:creator>r4i</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 03 Jul 2009 03:23:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1093773</guid>
		<description>you can resend any book you have purchased to any of your registered devices at any time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>you can resend any book you have purchased to any of your registered devices at any time.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Wallcraft</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1085009</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Wallcraft</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jun 2009 21:51:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1085009</guid>
		<description>If you deregister a Kindle it does not get deleted from the list of downloads for the ebooks you had on it.  So if you hit the device limit, Amazon has to manually delete the deregistered device from those ebooks one at a time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you deregister a Kindle it does not get deleted from the list of downloads for the ebooks you had on it.  So if you hit the device limit, Amazon has to manually delete the deregistered device from those ebooks one at a time.</p>
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		<title>By: Aaron Pressman</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1084881</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron Pressman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jun 2009 20:27:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1084881</guid>
		<description>HeavyG - Apparently, just deregistering a Kindle does not remove it from the 6 device limit. That&#039;s the actual problem that Dan Cohen ran into when he thought he was having per-book download limits.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>HeavyG &#8211; Apparently, just deregistering a Kindle does not remove it from the 6 device limit. That&#8217;s the actual problem that Dan Cohen ran into when he thought he was having per-book download limits.</p>
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		<title>By: Mags</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1084863</link>
		<dc:creator>Mags</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Jun 2009 20:03:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1084863</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Your “Manage Your Kindle” page allows complete control over your devices and you can resend any book you have purchased to any of your registered devices at any time.&lt;/i&gt;

But isn&#039;t that exactly what the article author had trouble doing?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Your “Manage Your Kindle” page allows complete control over your devices and you can resend any book you have purchased to any of your registered devices at any time.</i></p>
<p>But isn&#8217;t that exactly what the article author had trouble doing?</p>
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		<title>By: HeavyG</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1084074</link>
		<dc:creator>HeavyG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:42:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1084074</guid>
		<description>Mags - Amazon does have a way to add/remove devices. Whenever you get a new Kindle it has to be registered. Most of the time when you buy a Kindle from Amazon it has already been setup/registered to the buyers account so it is ready to go when you take it out of the box. If it was not already setup/registered you can do that from your Kindle in less than a minute.

If you need to deregister a Kindle from your account you can do that either from the Kindle or on your &quot;Manage Your Kindle&quot; page on Amazons site.

Your &quot;Manage Your Kindle&quot; page allows complete control over your devices and you can resend any book you have purchased to any of your registered devices at any time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mags &#8211; Amazon does have a way to add/remove devices. Whenever you get a new Kindle it has to be registered. Most of the time when you buy a Kindle from Amazon it has already been setup/registered to the buyers account so it is ready to go when you take it out of the box. If it was not already setup/registered you can do that from your Kindle in less than a minute.</p>
<p>If you need to deregister a Kindle from your account you can do that either from the Kindle or on your &#8220;Manage Your Kindle&#8221; page on Amazons site.</p>
<p>Your &#8220;Manage Your Kindle&#8221; page allows complete control over your devices and you can resend any book you have purchased to any of your registered devices at any time.</p>
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		<title>By: Mags</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1084059</link>
		<dc:creator>Mags</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:20:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1084059</guid>
		<description>Actually if Amazon had a way to register your six allowed devices, you could take one off and add another as you upgrade equipment. Books on Board does this and I think Fictionwise does as well. You have to re-download a book for each new device, but at least it works.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually if Amazon had a way to register your six allowed devices, you could take one off and add another as you upgrade equipment. Books on Board does this and I think Fictionwise does as well. You have to re-download a book for each new device, but at least it works.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Robinson</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1084049</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Robinson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:04:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1084049</guid>
		<description>The limits are not Amazon&#039;s fault, and for the most part they&#039;re pretty reasonable.  I don&#039;t have a problem with the 4-6 device limit, though I prefer mobi&#039;s multi-PID implementation to Amazon&#039;s single PID implementation.

My issue is that a) the Amazon customer service staff was not well trained on this issue at all; and b) there appears to be no way for the customer to know if a book is limited to n devices until they try downloading it to n+1 devices.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The limits are not Amazon&#8217;s fault, and for the most part they&#8217;re pretty reasonable.  I don&#8217;t have a problem with the 4-6 device limit, though I prefer mobi&#8217;s multi-PID implementation to Amazon&#8217;s single PID implementation.</p>
<p>My issue is that a) the Amazon customer service staff was not well trained on this issue at all; and b) there appears to be no way for the customer to know if a book is limited to n devices until they try downloading it to n+1 devices.</p>
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		<title>By: pond</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1084038</link>
		<dc:creator>pond</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 15:48:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1084038</guid>
		<description>I think it&#039;s pretty clear this is not Amazon&#039;s fault. They are dealing with publishers, who don&#039;t like digital books. At all. And who wake up each morning, no doubt, and look at the calendar, hoping it is 1960 again.

Really what this is, is evidence to present to the Library of Congress to allow for a DMCA exception for ebooks so that consumers can remove the encryption for one copy for their personal use.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it&#8217;s pretty clear this is not Amazon&#8217;s fault. They are dealing with publishers, who don&#8217;t like digital books. At all. And who wake up each morning, no doubt, and look at the calendar, hoping it is 1960 again.</p>
<p>Really what this is, is evidence to present to the Library of Congress to allow for a DMCA exception for ebooks so that consumers can remove the encryption for one copy for their personal use.</p>
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		<title>By: Aaron Pressman</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1084019</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron Pressman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 15:07:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1084019</guid>
		<description>p.s. alsp now the GearDiary guy has written a second post backtracking on the existence of a per-book download limit but now saying that some books have a less-than-six-devices sharing limit that&#039;s not disclosed. http://www.geardiary.com/2009/06/21/kindlegate-confusion-abounds-regarding-kindle-download-policy/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>p.s. alsp now the GearDiary guy has written a second post backtracking on the existence of a per-book download limit but now saying that some books have a less-than-six-devices sharing limit that&#8217;s not disclosed. <a href="http://www.geardiary.com/2009/06/21/kindlegate-confusion-abounds-regarding-kindle-download-policy/" rel="nofollow">http://www.geardiary.com/2009/06/21/kindlegate-confusion-abounds-regarding-kindle-download-policy/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Gerard Collins</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1084014</link>
		<dc:creator>Gerard Collins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 14:49:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1084014</guid>
		<description>Regarding the tip to back up Amazon purchases to your PC: It may only have limited usefulness.

I had to exchange my first Kindle 2 because of the fading-in-direct-sunlight display issue. Before I received the replacement, I backed everything in the documents folder on the Kindle up to my desktop -- a mix of items bought from Amazon and a lot of free texts from Feedbooks and Project Gutenberg -- then moved those items over to the new Kindle once it arrived. I didn&#039;t have very many purchased items, but what I did have didn&#039;t open. Those downloads are keyed to be read on specific Kindles and only on those specific Kindles. So backing up your files may let you put a purchased book back onto a Kindle from which it was erased, but it won&#039;t let you migrate it to a second device.

I agree that Amazon needs to disclose this information BEFORE its customers buy Kindle versions of books, especially since they advertise the idea of &quot;Automatic Library Backup&quot; right on the Kindle front page. If this function is limited or non-existent on certain titles, that needs to be made clear from the very beginning. And if it is being driven by publishers, it&#039;s coming across more as a money grab than a serious attempt to fight &quot;piracy&quot;. 

For all its faults, the iTunes store, before it dropped DRM altogether, was at least very clear and consistent throughout the catalog on how many computers you could authorize for playback, as well as how much each track cost. While I am very fond of the Kindle hardware and the reading experience using it, I am growing increasingly wary of buying anything much from the Kindle store itself. Between the variable pricing and this new DRM wrinkle, I&#039;m not likely to buy anything that I can&#039;t afford to suddenly and inexplicably lose outright. 

I&#039;m seriously starting to wonder if the publishing industry has a death wish. Either that, or they just enjoy believing themselves to be a perpetual victim, wringing their hands and complaining that they are abused, and wondering how &quot;the culture&quot; can survive without them. Everything happens to them, despite their noble efforts, because their customers, the readers, won&#039;t do what is expected of them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regarding the tip to back up Amazon purchases to your PC: It may only have limited usefulness.</p>
<p>I had to exchange my first Kindle 2 because of the fading-in-direct-sunlight display issue. Before I received the replacement, I backed everything in the documents folder on the Kindle up to my desktop &#8212; a mix of items bought from Amazon and a lot of free texts from Feedbooks and Project Gutenberg &#8212; then moved those items over to the new Kindle once it arrived. I didn&#8217;t have very many purchased items, but what I did have didn&#8217;t open. Those downloads are keyed to be read on specific Kindles and only on those specific Kindles. So backing up your files may let you put a purchased book back onto a Kindle from which it was erased, but it won&#8217;t let you migrate it to a second device.</p>
<p>I agree that Amazon needs to disclose this information BEFORE its customers buy Kindle versions of books, especially since they advertise the idea of &#8220;Automatic Library Backup&#8221; right on the Kindle front page. If this function is limited or non-existent on certain titles, that needs to be made clear from the very beginning. And if it is being driven by publishers, it&#8217;s coming across more as a money grab than a serious attempt to fight &#8220;piracy&#8221;. </p>
<p>For all its faults, the iTunes store, before it dropped DRM altogether, was at least very clear and consistent throughout the catalog on how many computers you could authorize for playback, as well as how much each track cost. While I am very fond of the Kindle hardware and the reading experience using it, I am growing increasingly wary of buying anything much from the Kindle store itself. Between the variable pricing and this new DRM wrinkle, I&#8217;m not likely to buy anything that I can&#8217;t afford to suddenly and inexplicably lose outright. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m seriously starting to wonder if the publishing industry has a death wish. Either that, or they just enjoy believing themselves to be a perpetual victim, wringing their hands and complaining that they are abused, and wondering how &#8220;the culture&#8221; can survive without them. Everything happens to them, despite their noble efforts, because their customers, the readers, won&#8217;t do what is expected of them.</p>
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		<title>By: Brad Vertrees</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1084005</link>
		<dc:creator>Brad Vertrees</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 14:22:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1084005</guid>
		<description>This is why I buy most of my ebooks from Fictionwise. Lets me download (most, not all) ebooks in whatever format I need and I keep the file stored locally on my computer. If FW ever goes under, I&#039;ll still have access to the ebooks I bought legally.

I&#039;m hoping Aaron is right - that public outrage will force publishers to get rid of DRM. It&#039;ll probably take a while and might even involve an act of congress, but I just can&#039;t see companies like Amazon getting away with stuff like this forever.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is why I buy most of my ebooks from Fictionwise. Lets me download (most, not all) ebooks in whatever format I need and I keep the file stored locally on my computer. If FW ever goes under, I&#8217;ll still have access to the ebooks I bought legally.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m hoping Aaron is right &#8211; that public outrage will force publishers to get rid of DRM. It&#8217;ll probably take a while and might even involve an act of congress, but I just can&#8217;t see companies like Amazon getting away with stuff like this forever.</p>
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		<title>By: Aaron Pressman</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1083987</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron Pressman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 13:12:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1083987</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m compiling a list of disclosed and rumored DRM limits. Perhaps growing public outrage will force publishers to drop DRM. Sounds like pie in the sky but it did happen in music. http://gravitationalpull.net/wp/?p=967</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m compiling a list of disclosed and rumored DRM limits. Perhaps growing public outrage will force publishers to drop DRM. Sounds like pie in the sky but it did happen in music. <a href="http://gravitationalpull.net/wp/?p=967" rel="nofollow">http://gravitationalpull.net/wp/?p=967</a></p>
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		<title>By: alex s</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1083953</link>
		<dc:creator>alex s</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 11:35:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1083953</guid>
		<description>I personally called Kindle customer support after reading the geardiary post. The service rep confirmed what he-the geardiary writer- said is true. The drm issue is entirely in the publishers court. They tell Amazon how many licenses it can issue for a book. Most books have high limits,-but as the commenter has found out- some only allow ONE DEVICE!! Yet another reason to support teleread&#039;s drm boycott, as well as the 9.99 boycott. Just in case you are counting this marks the third customer issue that publishers have created;license limits, price gouging, and text to speech disabling.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I personally called Kindle customer support after reading the geardiary post. The service rep confirmed what he-the geardiary writer- said is true. The drm issue is entirely in the publishers court. They tell Amazon how many licenses it can issue for a book. Most books have high limits,-but as the commenter has found out- some only allow ONE DEVICE!! Yet another reason to support teleread&#8217;s drm boycott, as well as the 9.99 boycott. Just in case you are counting this marks the third customer issue that publishers have created;license limits, price gouging, and text to speech disabling.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Robinson</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/comment-page-1/#comment-1083934</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Robinson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Jun 2009 10:39:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/2009/06/22/device-limits-fuzzy-on-downloads-for-kindle-books-if-so-should-the-ftc-investigate/#comment-1083934</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s pretty much what I would have expected.  Most retailers have their own take on the PID limitations for mobi, so I&#039;m not surprised Amazon has its own unique take on the problem.  Wish it was the solution too,  but that seems a trifle far-fetched for their current customer service policies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s pretty much what I would have expected.  Most retailers have their own take on the PID limitations for mobi, so I&#8217;m not surprised Amazon has its own unique take on the problem.  Wish it was the solution too,  but that seems a trifle far-fetched for their current customer service policies.</p>
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