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	<title>Comments on: OverDrive to offer DRM-free audiobooks via Borders: Time to try unshackled e-books, too?</title>
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	<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/</link>
	<description>News &#38; views on e-books, libraries, publishing and related topics</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 22:47:19 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Links of Interest (February 21st 2008 through April 1st 2008) &#183; All the Billion Other Moments (Jason Penney)</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-749098</link>
		<dc:creator>Links of Interest (February 21st 2008 through April 1st 2008) &#183; All the Billion Other Moments (Jason Penney)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Apr 2008 00:32:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-749098</guid>
		<description>[...] OverDrive to offer DRM-free audiobooks via Borders: Time to try unshackled e-books, too?This can only be good news. OverDrive has an interesting history with DRM. They have always claimed to be unable to work with iPods due to Apple&#8217;s proprietary DRM, while failing to make clear they were using Microsoft&#8217;s proprietary DRM.Tags: OverDrive, Audiobooks, DRM, [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] OverDrive to offer DRM-free audiobooks via Borders: Time to try unshackled e-books, too?This can only be good news. OverDrive has an interesting history with DRM. They have always claimed to be unable to work with iPods due to Apple&#8217;s proprietary DRM, while failing to make clear they were using Microsoft&#8217;s proprietary DRM.Tags: OverDrive, Audiobooks, DRM, [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Lester</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-741402</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Lester</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Mar 2008 15:18:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-741402</guid>
		<description>David, as always a good conversation...

To me, Libraries are places where content may be read or borrowed.   Permanent checkout isn't really "borrowed", but is instead "give". This would put the libraries squarely into wide scale content distribution, and place them into direct competition with other distributors (book stores/publishers/content creators themselves).  To experiment with this model in libraries while still handling your points 2 and 3 for anything other than 'free' content (ie Project Gutenberg) or from the more adventurous (forward thinking?) publishers will require legislation, and legislation is just not someplace I want to see experimentation done.

Instead of trying to extend the "borrowed" part of Libraries into E (without DRM), another possibility is to try to extend "read" instead.  I could see potentially something like O'Reilly's Safari model of allowing users to have online access to limited number of books at a time, and then couple that with a full text index engine to replace the current card catalogs for finding the content that you actually want to find.  This would fit in nicely with expanding at least the research use of libraries while still respecting the copyrights of the content owners.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David, as always a good conversation&#8230;</p>
<p>To me, Libraries are places where content may be read or borrowed.   Permanent checkout isn&#8217;t really &#8220;borrowed&#8221;, but is instead &#8220;give&#8221;. This would put the libraries squarely into wide scale content distribution, and place them into direct competition with other distributors (book stores/publishers/content creators themselves).  To experiment with this model in libraries while still handling your points 2 and 3 for anything other than &#8216;free&#8217; content (ie Project Gutenberg) or from the more adventurous (forward thinking?) publishers will require legislation, and legislation is just not someplace I want to see experimentation done.</p>
<p>Instead of trying to extend the &#8220;borrowed&#8221; part of Libraries into E (without DRM), another possibility is to try to extend &#8220;read&#8221; instead.  I could see potentially something like O&#8217;Reilly&#8217;s Safari model of allowing users to have online access to limited number of books at a time, and then couple that with a full text index engine to replace the current card catalogs for finding the content that you actually want to find.  This would fit in nicely with expanding at least the research use of libraries while still respecting the copyrights of the content owners.</p>
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		<title>By: David Rothman</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-741178</link>
		<dc:creator>David Rothman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Mar 2008 08:35:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-741178</guid>
		<description>Jim: As usual thanks. Actually I think libraries will be in trouble if they &lt;em&gt;don't&lt;/em&gt; don't experiment with new models. 

This experimentation should be done with at least several things in mind--all important:

1. User convenience. DRM is anti-convenience. On my XO, my main e-book reader in effect, I can't read either Adobe or Mobi books from the public library. The DRM is in the villain, of course.

2. Respect for the rights of content creators. When I propose permanent checkouts, for example, I'm fully aware of the need for compensation to be adjusted. 

3. We need to think about digital divide issues. If there is a fee for expanding the number of permanent checkouts allowed, perhaps it could be waived for people making less than X dollars a year.

What conditions would you or others like to add to the list?

Thanks,
David</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jim: As usual thanks. Actually I think libraries will be in trouble if they <em>don&#8217;t</em> don&#8217;t experiment with new models. </p>
<p>This experimentation should be done with at least several things in mind&#8211;all important:</p>
<p>1. User convenience. DRM is anti-convenience. On my XO, my main e-book reader in effect, I can&#8217;t read either Adobe or Mobi books from the public library. The DRM is in the villain, of course.</p>
<p>2. Respect for the rights of content creators. When I propose permanent checkouts, for example, I&#8217;m fully aware of the need for compensation to be adjusted. </p>
<p>3. We need to think about digital divide issues. If there is a fee for expanding the number of permanent checkouts allowed, perhaps it could be waived for people making less than X dollars a year.</p>
<p>What conditions would you or others like to add to the list?</p>
<p>Thanks,<br />
David</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Lester</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740869</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Lester</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2008 23:40:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740869</guid>
		<description>David,
   Yes there should be a variety of approaches, and I'm glad to see both Amazon, Baen and Wowio, all comfortably existing in the space.  However since most of the approaches involve either new business models, or tweaks/extensions to existing ones, perhaps libraries are not the best places to be conducting these experiments.

Garson,
   For publishers that don't wish to provide their content under a 'free' license, the alternative for libraries is not E content free of DRM, but no  E content at all.  Publishers really don't want to have to compete with free, and forcing them to do so (ie compulsory licensing of DRM free E content to libraries) would be wrong.  The best way to fight DRM is not through legislation but through your pocketbook. People are starting to notice, from the record industry to the game industry (Ars had a good write up on people waking up in the game industry:
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080320-pc-game-developer-has-radical-message-ignore-the-pirates.html )</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David,<br />
   Yes there should be a variety of approaches, and I&#8217;m glad to see both Amazon, Baen and Wowio, all comfortably existing in the space.  However since most of the approaches involve either new business models, or tweaks/extensions to existing ones, perhaps libraries are not the best places to be conducting these experiments.</p>
<p>Garson,<br />
   For publishers that don&#8217;t wish to provide their content under a &#8216;free&#8217; license, the alternative for libraries is not E content free of DRM, but no  E content at all.  Publishers really don&#8217;t want to have to compete with free, and forcing them to do so (ie compulsory licensing of DRM free E content to libraries) would be wrong.  The best way to fight DRM is not through legislation but through your pocketbook. People are starting to notice, from the record industry to the game industry (Ars had a good write up on people waking up in the game industry:<br />
<a href="http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080320-pc-game-developer-has-radical-message-ignore-the-pirates.html" rel="nofollow">http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20080320-pc-game-developer-has-radical-message-ignore-the-pirates.html</a> )</p>
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		<title>By: Garson O'Toole</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740801</link>
		<dc:creator>Garson O'Toole</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2008 22:00:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740801</guid>
		<description>When e-books and audiobooks from libraries are encumbered with DRM (Digital Restrictions Management) the perverse goal is to enforce artificial scarcity as Jim Lester notes insightfully. However, it is much easier to give a library patron an unencumbered DRM-free item that remains accessible and usable without a time restriction. Abstruse, inflexible and buggy electronic mechanisms that implement expiration dates cause untold aggravation. 

Often the items from libraries can only be used on specialized platforms. For example, audiobooks from NetLibrary and OverDrive do not work with the most popular class of audio players, iPods. Sadly the quixotic pursuit of artificial scarcity impoverishes everyone. I do believe that artists should be compensated, but the often retrograde strategies of payment used in previous centuries are not by themselves adequate to the requirements of the twenty-first. David Rothman’s comments about permanent checkout are worth thinking about.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When e-books and audiobooks from libraries are encumbered with DRM (Digital Restrictions Management) the perverse goal is to enforce artificial scarcity as Jim Lester notes insightfully. However, it is much easier to give a library patron an unencumbered DRM-free item that remains accessible and usable without a time restriction. Abstruse, inflexible and buggy electronic mechanisms that implement expiration dates cause untold aggravation. </p>
<p>Often the items from libraries can only be used on specialized platforms. For example, audiobooks from NetLibrary and OverDrive do not work with the most popular class of audio players, iPods. Sadly the quixotic pursuit of artificial scarcity impoverishes everyone. I do believe that artists should be compensated, but the often retrograde strategies of payment used in previous centuries are not by themselves adequate to the requirements of the twenty-first. David Rothman’s comments about permanent checkout are worth thinking about.</p>
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		<title>By: David Rothman</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740799</link>
		<dc:creator>David Rothman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2008 21:53:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740799</guid>
		<description>Hi, Jim. Given how tough publishers have it now, I think that it might be possible to come up with alternatives. Again, however, let me emphasize the need to protect the private sector. We need a &lt;em&gt;variety&lt;/em&gt; of approaches since different ones favor different kinds of books. Thanks. David</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, Jim. Given how tough publishers have it now, I think that it might be possible to come up with alternatives. Again, however, let me emphasize the need to protect the private sector. We need a <em>variety</em> of approaches since different ones favor different kinds of books. Thanks. David</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Lester</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740752</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Lester</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2008 20:42:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740752</guid>
		<description>(First mea culpa for not reading your article more carefully, mostly I was responding to the DbD article).

The current balance between libraries and publishers has worked because of the scarcity of P.  Without artificially introducing this scarcity into E with DRM ( by forcing an expiration), a new model would have to be developed. Or to put it another way:  permanents checkouts are just a variant on how to purchase the content, which if adopted would essentially transform libraries into non-profit bookstores.  While some publishers might be interested in giving advantageous terms to non-profits, this is not something that I would like to see made compulsory on all publishers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(First mea culpa for not reading your article more carefully, mostly I was responding to the DbD article).</p>
<p>The current balance between libraries and publishers has worked because of the scarcity of P.  Without artificially introducing this scarcity into E with DRM ( by forcing an expiration), a new model would have to be developed. Or to put it another way:  permanents checkouts are just a variant on how to purchase the content, which if adopted would essentially transform libraries into non-profit bookstores.  While some publishers might be interested in giving advantageous terms to non-profits, this is not something that I would like to see made compulsory on all publishers.</p>
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		<title>By: David Rothman</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740557</link>
		<dc:creator>David Rothman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2008 14:10:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740557</guid>
		<description>Hi, Jim. Many thanks for your reply. Keep in mind that in advocating social DRM for libraries, I alluded to "permanent checkouts." Yes, people could keep the books forever, just so they didn't spread them around outside fair use. 

As for social DRM itself, remember the idea reached me from none other than Adobe's Bill McCoy. I think it would be wonderful if Adobe and other IDPF members participated in experiments---both library- and retail-related---with the SDRM approach. 

Publishers would receive higher compensation from libraries than for books that expired. No free lunch expected. Patrons would have yearly or month quotas, which they could pay extra to raise. 

Or---gasp---there could also be ad-supported biz models, like Wowio's, in appropriate situations. The ads could be spread around, Google-fashion, and librarians could screen out ads disguised as books. 

I'd rather see books without ads, and I know that advertising is not a panacea; just one possibility. It would also help to have a TeleRead-style plan to provide for mass financing of library e-books, while taking care to keep the private sector alive, given the freedom of expression issues involved. 

&lt;em&gt;Bottom line:&lt;/em&gt; I'm well aware of all the issues SDRM raises, and believe there are solutions if people will look beyond tech alone and think more about business models.

Thanks,
David</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, Jim. Many thanks for your reply. Keep in mind that in advocating social DRM for libraries, I alluded to &#8220;permanent checkouts.&#8221; Yes, people could keep the books forever, just so they didn&#8217;t spread them around outside fair use. </p>
<p>As for social DRM itself, remember the idea reached me from none other than Adobe&#8217;s Bill McCoy. I think it would be wonderful if Adobe and other IDPF members participated in experiments&#8212;both library- and retail-related&#8212;with the SDRM approach. </p>
<p>Publishers would receive higher compensation from libraries than for books that expired. No free lunch expected. Patrons would have yearly or month quotas, which they could pay extra to raise. </p>
<p>Or&#8212;gasp&#8212;there could also be ad-supported biz models, like Wowio&#8217;s, in appropriate situations. The ads could be spread around, Google-fashion, and librarians could screen out ads disguised as books. </p>
<p>I&#8217;d rather see books without ads, and I know that advertising is not a panacea; just one possibility. It would also help to have a TeleRead-style plan to provide for mass financing of library e-books, while taking care to keep the private sector alive, given the freedom of expression issues involved. </p>
<p><em>Bottom line:</em> I&#8217;m well aware of all the issues SDRM raises, and believe there are solutions if people will look beyond tech alone and think more about business models.</p>
<p>Thanks,<br />
David</p>
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		<title>By: Katy</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740534</link>
		<dc:creator>Katy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2008 13:08:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740534</guid>
		<description>FYI...If you purchase an audiobook from Overdrive and burn it to a CD, you can upload it to a different computer without the DRM. I was even able to get the audiobook on my ipod, which is on Overdrive's list of unsupported devices.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FYI&#8230;If you purchase an audiobook from Overdrive and burn it to a CD, you can upload it to a different computer without the DRM. I was even able to get the audiobook on my ipod, which is on Overdrive&#8217;s list of unsupported devices.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Lester</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740027</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Lester</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Mar 2008 19:48:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-740027</guid>
		<description>For the lending case, I don't see any form of watermarking as a viable alternative to the more traditional DRM.  Without a way to ensure that the book is unreadable (ie it expires) after the lending period, I can't see publishers/authors (except for those that 'free' their content) being comfortable with allowing libraries to lend out  material - effectively becoming a non time limited free competitor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For the lending case, I don&#8217;t see any form of watermarking as a viable alternative to the more traditional DRM.  Without a way to ensure that the book is unreadable (ie it expires) after the lending period, I can&#8217;t see publishers/authors (except for those that &#8216;free&#8217; their content) being comfortable with allowing libraries to lend out  material - effectively becoming a non time limited free competitor.</p>
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		<title>By: pond</title>
		<link>http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-739920</link>
		<dc:creator>pond</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 Mar 2008 16:30:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.teleread.org/blog/2008/03/19/overdrive-to-offer-drm-free-audiobooks-via-borders/#comment-739920</guid>
		<description>Every time a DRM is killed, a puppy is born with a butterfly on its nose...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Every time a DRM is killed, a puppy is born with a butterfly on its nose&#8230;</p>
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